2007-11-13
It's Official, IATAN Drops YTB
Well, last night I said the silence from YTB was telling in regards to the IATAN issue. Sometimes, they say a picture is worth a thousand words.....
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53 comments:
This is interesting. I would love to be a fly on the wall as the owners of YTB and the other 3 companies decide what to do next. I am concerned for the agents and clients within the company who booked travel in good faith. This is going to be a huge mess.
"It's Official, IATAN Drops YTB"
Really?
I just went to CLIA Travel Agent Center with the YTB CLIA number.
It went through just fine and said,
"WELCOME YTB Travel Network of Illinois. THANK YOU FOR BEING A CLIA TRAVEL AGENCY MEMBER!"
IATAN and CLIA are two separate organizations. The only thing they have in common is the letters "I" and "A".
The IATAN card is the one that is purported to be the key to the city of travel perks. Now YTB will no longer be able to use that in their arsenal of marketing.
The industry is beginning to take notice. This giant is beginning to wake up.
I'm am constantly astounded at the level of knowledge the YTB'ers exhibit about the industry they pretend to work in.
I have to agree, this person has no clue that IATAN and CLIA are two different entities. You would think with the VAST knownledge these "agents" have, they would at least know the difference.
"It's Official, IATAN Drops YTB"
Really?
Yes really! And the fact that you did not know the difference between CLIA and IATA is just one more reason why you shouldn't be in this business!
YTB is still a travel agency for many reasons; one of those reasons is our affiliation with ARC and CLIA. Having IATAN status does not legitimize YTB. It did offer an additional avenue for resources and supplier contacts as well as a card that must be earned. See below for a general description of ARC, IATA, and IATAN.
ARC: ARC services the Travel industry as a financial clearinghouse, information hub and meeting place for business relationships among Carriers, Travel Agents, Corporate Travel Departments, Industry Suppliers and others. It also provides a means of communication between its participants and important third parties, including industry associations, news media and government agencies. No matter what your role in today's Travel industry, ARC can offer you greater efficiency, visibility and impact.
ARC participants — from start-up Travel Agencies through global Carriers — benefit from the integrity, innovation, cost-effectiveness and excellence built into every ARC product and service.
ARC-accredited Travel Agencies are premium professional Travel organizations.
Having met the rigorous financial, personnel and ticket-security requirements and successfully completed stringent training and specialist testing, ARC-accredited Agencies demonstrate a commitment to the health and growth of their businesses and to the Travel industry as a whole.
Across the United States, Puerto Rico and the U.S. Virgin Islands, Agencies of every size, from single locations to multinational operations, depend on ARC to deliver reliable solutions to help them improve their business practices and better serve their customers.
IATA: Air transport is one of the most dynamic industries in the world. The International Air Transport Association (IATA) is its global trade organization.
Over 60 years, IATA has developed the commercial standards that built a global industry. Today, IATA’s mission is to represent, lead and serve the airline industry. Its members comprise over 240 airlines - the world’s leading passenger and cargo airlines among them - representing 94 percent of scheduled international air traffic.
Representing…
IATA seeks to improve understanding of the industry among decision makers and increase awareness of the benefits that aviation brings to national and global economies. It fights for the interests of airlines across the globe, challenging unreasonable rules and charges, holding regulators and governments to account, and striving for sensible regulation.
IATAN: Through the use of its informational and other resources, IATAN provides a vital link between the supplier community and the U.S. travel distribution network. As an IATAN accredited travel agency, you now have full access to all of our products and services. These include Personnel Registration, IATAN Travel Agent ID Card, Personnel Verification as well as educational programs.
Is YTB ARC approved? I thought the air transactions were handled vis WTS/Travelocity.
If that is the case, they are being run on their ARC number which makes sense since the RTAs earn $6 "commission" which is merely a rebate from WTS on the overrides, commissions, and segment count bonuses they receive.
If YTB is an ARC accredited agency, I imagine they will soon jump on the bandwagon of IATAN. To be honest, ARC does not make enough money off the agency end to warrant the exposure to liability. So I bet they follow.
CLIA has found their cash cow with YTB. With YTB infusing the industry with 500 agents a day, CLIA is loving this. Even more so now since the IATAN benefit card is out of reach---everyone will be clamoring for the CLIA card. CLIA is nothign but pimp in the travel business.
YTBers will now have no access to non-cruise FAMS, without the IATA will likely not get hotel/rental car discounts, will not be entitled to air discounts either.
IATAN uses the number that you are assigned by ARC for your IATAN membership. CLIA uses that same number as well when there is one. Because CLIA uses that number to identify you as a CLIA member you are still granted access - that does not mean that you are accredited by IATAN.
I would say there is worse news to come - being "delisted" if you will by IATAN is quite serious and it is very possible that ARC will follow suit. CLIA will not as they are always looking for more money - however, they Cruise Lines (some of them) could could very well pull out of their CLIA membership over this and belive me, CLIA needs the big membership money a lot more than it does the membership funds. this could be interesting......
The silence from the Big Dogs at YTB on this is deafening. You would think that if this was not true, they would be shouting from every venue possible to let us know that this is not true...but they are not saying anything, are they?
Many Tour Operators will not accept CLIA as an identifier for an Agent/Agency so this may only leave cruises to the discredited MLMs. Still, cruising alone could bring in a nice income.....
This is all very interesting...
You never know. This could actually force YTB to try to go legit. Their big selling point is that their mlmers will get the all-mighty travel agent id card. With that no longer being an option what will they do? Will they actually try to be a real travel agency? A cruise only agency? Will they move on to something else?
There are a few YTBers who were actually training themselves and trying to provide a service. I feel bad for those people. If the people at the top had not abused this industry so badly, this never would have happened. Even if CLIA does allow them to stay, they will never gain any respect from the travel industry.
Just spoke with HQ a few hours ago and apparently this is just a simple misunderstanding.
Check the website tomorrow and I bet all is ok
God Bless!
Simple, is that what YTB HQ tell you. If my company told me that I would be worried. Something like that isnt a "simple misunderstanding". Sounds like more fluff and lies as usual. Glad I left them months ago.
If I were affiliated with YTB right now, I would be contacting an attorney....
God Bless!
That's interesting. Wasn't it a "simple misunderstanding" with RCCL as well?
Thank you for your blog post here. Any additional information that you could post would be great. I will subscribe to your blog and check back here.
Thank you
My condolences to YTB'ers out there. But, there IS one company that is doing it right; we are going to be her for the Long Haul. I invite all who read here to explore www.globetravelers.WORLDVENTURES.biz. Look carefully at what we offer, and also our remarkable Dream Trips product. Our travel search technology is the strongest on the internet as well. No, MLM and TRAVEL is NOT a bad combination at all...it just has not been done properly. We have a product (Dream Trips), and a comp plan that is remarkable and fair, and can be explained on a napkin. We have excellent leadership with vision and integrity. Please, at least, go to the above site and see for yourself. Try our search engine and compare it to your favorite one; you will be amazed. Scroll through our Dream Trips and rub your eyes at the prices (they are real!)..and then email me at modesto3719@aol.com. We welcome YTB'ers and will give them a home where they can succeed in the travel business beyond anything they imagined in YTB. Come one...come all!...Laura
The reason the YTB IATA / IATAN is currently on hold or invalid is due to YTB is being audited by IATA.
YTB is the largest Company that currently sells Travel via relationship marketing.
That is the reason YTB is one of the first Companies being audited that use this type of business model is to insure that everyone that has been issued their own IATA number within YTB has as actually earned $ 5,000 in travel commissions in a 12 month period.
For all of the people in other (smaller) companies that use relationship marketing to sell Travel but have not been targeted yet, believe me your IATA audit is coming. Your Comapny is just so small compared to YTB that they have not got to your Company yet.
Once the audit is complete YTB's IATA number / Credential's will once again work.
With regards to RCCL there was an on going dispute with regards to how long RCCL took to pay YTB even after RCCL had received the payament for cruises booked with them.
When YTB stood up for their RTA's and demanded payments be sent sooner then RCCL decided to pull away from YTB.
After what happened Nov. 8th (The most Cruise bookings by any Travel Agency in a single day) we would be surprised if RCCL does not change their stance but who knows if YTB will decide to book with them after all that has transpired.
It really does not matter if you all believe this or not as I have never posted here and probably will not again but I am just amazed at all of the hate and lies from people that really don't know what is going on behind the scenes.
Also it amazes me that people in smaller Travel Networking Companies are spouting off about how great their Company is and trying to parlay these latest develpements into a recruiting tool, when there Company is next in line based on the same or simliar criteria.
Since YTB is the biggest (and best in mu humble opinion) everyone is gunning for them first and not your smaller Companies yet.
I wish you all the best even if you are a part of a traditional brick and mortor Travel Agency or a Networking business type Travel Agency.
Remember we are all in the Travel Industry and we all live in glass houses!!
Best regards,
D. Curry
Poor D, you are so misinformed - hope you didn't get all that from Coach.
First, most Agencies of all sizes have been audited at least once - it has nothing to do with YTB's size.
Second, but most important, YOU ARE BEING "AUDITED" (as you wish to call it) BECAUSE THE YTB CARD GIVEN TO EVERY SINGLE RTA (until the recent changes) LISTED:
CLIA/IATAN and then the number.
THIS IS CLEARLY IN VIOLATION OF IATAN'S RULES.
Third, when IATAN audits - the send you a warning let and they do not invalidate your number (as YTB's has been - check it on www.checkacode.com) unless AFTER the audit they find a problem.
You are so in the dark!
"After what happened Nov. 8th (The most Cruise bookings by any Travel Agency in a single day)"
When audited for this statistic, they will most likely find what they found before - that most are purchasing travel for themselves.
"Steve Perillo, president of Perillo Tours, said that when he read Royal Caribbean was weeding out "card mills" and that YTB was on the list, he decided to have a look at YTB bookings for his firm.
He said he found that "90% of the travelers and booking agents were the same person. ...I would love for all agents to take our tours, but this is not the idea. It is to support agents to learn and sell the product, not to use this for their own travel discounts. ...This is abusing the privileges of sellers," he said."
In other words, if all YTB did on November 8 was self-purchase the majority of the cruises or certificates, they were hurting themselves more than helping...
Would you rather have a DVD player, or a VCR?...Would you rather shop at KMart or Walmart? WORLD VENTURES is the DVD player..we are "Walmart"...we are the "better idea" that is going to dominate online travel booking. There's no doubt...what a great time to join us!
I would encourage everyone to go to WWW.TRAVELPRESENTATION.COM to see for yourself what World Ventures brings to this table.
I met with the top YTB'er in my city today; she has a big organization and said to me, "I'll tell you who will not exist in 5 years..IATA will not exist, but YTB will be going strong."She has a large YTB organization, but this sort of arrogance (or ignorance?)is frightening.
IATA was established in 1996 as a self-policing agency in the travel world. Yet Ythis YTB leader insists that IATA is the one who will 'go down', in effect saying, 'we are ABOVE the policing agency?"
This is their corporate spin. She even admitted that she signed 6 people up yesterday, taking their $500 bills and minimizing (or probably not even telling?) the company's problems.
EVERY MLM company that has ever bit the dust went down denying that anything was wrong, until the FTC barred their doors, taking in new members until the very end.Remember Excel? BurnLounge?
Will this happen to YTB? I don't know; it is possible they will survive and continue to be a leader in online travel.
But, do you want to risk any more of your money and time?
Again, I invite ALL YTB reps to look at a newly emerging travel giant that is doing it RIGHT...World Ventures. We are unique among ALL other travel companies in (1)our search technology (2)our Dream Trips wholesale vacation product (3)our live booking agent that helps you finalize your purchase (4)our compansation plan (5)our stellar leadership (6)our unique and state-of-the art web site (go to www.globetravelers.worldventures.biz.) Please go there and see for yourself. And then, call Laura at 502-727-9774. We welcome disillusioned (or broke!) YTB reps.
Oh By The Way…..
YTB International Announces Second Consecutive Quarter of Profitability
Wednesday November 14, 5:30 pm ET
Company Reports Record Revenues of $39.9 Million
WOOD RIVER, Ill., Nov. 14 /PRNewswire-FirstCall/ -- YTB International, Inc. (OTC PK: YTBLA) ('"YTB" or the "Company"), a provider of Internet-based travel booking services for travel agencies and home-based independent representatives in the United States, today announced its financial results for the three and nine-month periods ended September 30, 2007.
Total revenue for the quarter ended September 30, 2007 increased 203.5% to $39.9 million compared to $13.1 million for the third quarter last year. Revenue generated from online travel store sales and monthly fees from Referring Travel Agents ("RTAs") in the third quarter of 2007 was $28.7 million, compared to $9.0 million in the third quarter of 2006. Revenue from travel agency commissions in the third quarter of 2007 was $5.5 million, compared to $2.0 million for the same period last year. Also, training programs and marketing materials revenue increased in the third quarter of 2007 to $3.7 million, from $1.5 million in the prior year quarter.
Net income for the third quarter of 2007 was $2.1 million, or $0.02 per diluted share, compared to a net loss of ($4.4) million, or ($0.05) per diluted share, for the third quarter of 2006.
Total revenue for the nine months ended September 30, 2007 increased 207.6% to $95.9 million, compared to $31.2 million for the same period last year. Revenue generated from online travel store sales and monthly fees from RTAs for the nine months ended September 30, 2007 was $69.0 million, compared to $22.5 million for the same period in 2006. Revenue from travel agency commissions for the first nine months of 2007 was $13.9 million, compared to $5.1 million for the same period last year. Training programs and marketing materials revenue for the nine months ended September 30, 2007 was $10.4 million, up from $2.9 million in the same period last year.
Net income for the nine months ended September 30, 2007 was $1.6 million, or $0.01 per diluted share, compared to a net loss of ($6.0) million, or ($0.07) per diluted share, for the same period in 2006.
"We are proud to report our second consecutive quarter of profitability and record revenue and net income figures of $39.9 million and $2.1 million respectively. This accomplishment was achieved despite certain one-time costs incurred during the period that are related to the continued expansion of our infrastructure in order to support our growing number of RTAs and to improve our services," stated Scott Tomer, Chief Executive Officer of YTB International. "In the first nine months of 2007 alone, we have doubled the size of our RTA network to more than 134,000 RTAs, and we see no signs of slowing down. Our success did not go unnoticed. Travel Weekly named us one of the top eleven leisure travel agencies and one of the 35 largest travel agencies overall for 2006."
Mr. Tomer continued, "We have high expectations for YTB International's future and are expanding our infrastructure and training capabilities in order to handle our continued growth. Our new RTAs will need the best tools and training. To meet this need, we recently launched a proprietary Web-based training certification and testing program, 'YTB E-Campus,' designed by Dr. Marc Mancini, one of the travel industry's most highly respected speakers, educators and consultants. This training program offers our RTAs a unique opportunity to hone their skills to successfully sell travel and build their businesses."
Marketing commissions increased by $11,129,961 or 117.5% in the third quarter of 2007 to $20,603,925 from $9,473,964 in the third quarter of 2006. This increase is due to the significant increase in active RTAs recruited by our Reps. The increase is also due to an increase in the number of sales directors in the Company along with an increase in the amount paid out to the entire Director's Pool. The Director's Pool consists of Reps who have achieved certain performance levels within the Company which entitles them to additional commissions on the number of new sales, monthly renewals and the number of training events held.
· Travel commissions for the third quarter of 2007 increased by $2,564,481 or 190.2% to $3,913,021 from $1,348,540 reported in the third quarter of 2006. The increase is attributable to the increase in the number of customers utilizing the Company as their travel provider in 2007 due to the significant growth in the number of RTAs. NOT BAD FOR A COMPANY THAT ISN’T LOOKED AT AS A TRAVEL COMPANY
About YTB International
Recognized as the 35th largest seller of travel in the U.S. by Travel Weekly, YTB International, Inc. provides Internet-based travel booking services for travel agencies and home-based independent representatives in the United States, Puerto Rico, and the US Virgin Islands. It operates through three subsidiaries: YourTravelBiz.com, Inc., YTB Travel Network, Inc., and REZconnect Technologies, Inc.
Then why did YTB's stock close today at a whopping $1.20 per share? Is it even WORTH the paper it's written on?
Larger MLM companies than his one currently is have been shut down (with that many reps and more). Size is no guarantee of invincibilty.
The jury is still out on this one. When the dust settles, they MAY still be standing. But, as for me...I'm not going to invest $500 in the Titanic.
FOOL! Did you miss the Travel Weekly piece that pretty much admitted that they accepted "cooked" numbers from YTB last year?
Did you also miss Arnie's piece that lamented the type of behavior expressed by YTBers and thier apparenent ignorance of the industry?
And this morning the stock OPENED $.12 DOWN!!!! That is a HUGE drop at opening - very ominous. Of course, it is just the opening - certainly could go up during the day......
I'm not a member of YTB but have been presented with the "opportunity" etc. WHAT I SIMPLY cannot understand, is:
1) Why are YTB RTA's not more concerned about the loss of the IATAN number? Cursory due diligence will tell you that several things are wrong with this pcture. And it isn't all about traditional agents disdain for MLM companies.
2) Why do I NOT see an SEC 8-K filing from YTB about this 'material event'!!!
I wouldn't buy the stock and I certainly see no reason to market a business plan into this prevailing headwind... Guy's D'nile is in Egypt!
Stock price is being affected as well... ( even after the earnings release! )
YTB agents are 'not more concerned' because they are believing what their upline (and corporate headquarters) are telling them..'This is just a blip'..."it will all be straightened out'...."it is no big deal."
May I remind everyone: When both Excel and BurnLounge finally were shut down, it was after months of telling their reps, "nothing is wrong'.."everything is fine.."
There's incredible lack of integrity in that, or simply plain denial...because they are out enlisting new members right and left, and taking their $500.
So, the longer corporate can convince everyone to keep signing new reps, they continue to milk this cow until keels over dead.
How much did you all lose today?
YTB INTL INC CL A (Other OTC:YTBLA.PK)
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I agree with most of the comments of your editorial.
Most peole join YTB for the perks and the MLM opportunity (although that is a lot harder than many of them realize) and invariably have no idea or intention of selling travel.
But why this clearly defensive posture by the Travel Establishment?
Are you afraid of something? You all survived the onslaught of the big dog travel portals like Travelocity, Expedia etc. This is just a new twist to it, a different marketing ploy.
Is YTB growing faster tha you would like? Has it put even more pressure on the margins? Isn't that what all new business models tend to do?
Are you defensive because YTB, by giving perks, attempts to put some fun and glamour back into the drab travel experience of the ordinary traveler?
The drab experience caused by years of poor management by organizations like IATA And ALL?
I have not used a travel agent since 1996, for most of my travel I used Travelocity or the vendors websites.
Even when I used a travel agency I had to advise the agent about routing to get better deals. So how much more did they know about the business than the everage YTB'er?
I think the only people who still use Travel Agents like AMEX or Wagon Lits are the hughe blue chip corporations who have a hard time changing.
The money and fun in this business is in the all in and group travel opportunities headed by the Cruise Lines and Las Vegas.
Who wants to sell Airline tickets or car rentals?
I hate MLM but I love the Travel Business. I focus on getting my customers the best travel deals. I use my knowledge to scour the industry, so they do not have to, and find them value for money that they would never be able to find on their own.
I do have a Toll Free phone number and a street address on my website.
I do encourage my customers to call me if they are uncomfortable with the web or do not have the time.
That is better service than they can get from Travelocity or Expedia.
To focus on the MLM part and its shortcomoings would be the wrong way of looking at YTB.
YTB should be looked at as a high growth business model, with all its imperfections, warts and all.
The quickest way to grow a travel, any, business in a start up mode is to do it exactly the way YTB is doing it right now. The growth rates bear that out.
The MLM model and the perks are there to stimulate a growth rate that would not be attainable in any other way.
That is probaly not the way it will evolve in the long run and the market forces will make adjustments to the model in a more mature state.
The focus will probably shift from selling portals to selling travel.
The model definitely makes sense for individual travelers that spend over $6K in travel per year. As well as for small companies such as sole proprietors like CPA, consulting and engineering professionals. Also Churches and Organizations will benefit from this model.
All this is to come.
As for the short run,
Who cares if some members carry credentials that they do not really deserve! The Companies who honor those credentials ar at fault. One does not give people privileges because of their pretty eyes do they?
Can the vendors not tell if the person is a travel agent with impressive turnover? Are the systems of the traditional travel world so antiquated that they do not capture this kind of information? Shame on them!
Although it seems unlikely that the holder of an Iatan card is not at least a very frequent traveller, given the rules of obtaining one at YTB.
I am sure that all these things will sort themselves out. All the upheavel in the recent weeks will not go unnoticed and no doubt YTB will have to make corrections in midstream.
Drivel about share movements clearly shows ignorance of the behaviour of the stockmarkets and has nothing fundamentally to do with a companies performance.
In any case I am confident that YTB management will stay away from any knee jerk reactions and set the ship back on its course.
I am certain that the vigour with which the establishments are attacking YTB is a sign that YTB is a force to be reckoned with in its quest to make travel even more affordable to the individual traveler and simultaneously make the all too drab experience of travel a littlemore glamorous and fun.
Because that is what this is ultimately all about.
TRAVELOCITY PHASE II
"Are you defensive because YTB, by giving perks, attempts to put some fun and glamour back into the drab travel experience of the ordinary traveler?"
BINGO.
Perks should be EARNED, not BOUGHT.
From the petition:
http://www.petitiononline.com/NOMLM/petition.html
"Many agents have invested much time and effort to learn how to sell travel and how to serve travelers. The MLM model is in the business of selling credentials with a minimum of any professional commitment or training. These programs simply abuse any vendor incentives."
Bouwou--first thanks for not being anonymous.
The issue, as I see it is multi faceted.
1. The vast majority of MLM agents (and this is not unique to YTB) are untrained (their personal fault), and have an unrealistic expectation of the money to be earned. They are going forth into the streets and professing to be travel agents. The public is believing this and getting a bum deal. The pricing is not any more attractive, and the risk of having a travel experience screwed up is great. Again, I am talking the majority--maybe not you.
2. An extension of that is that the consumer has very little places to go for help. The websites do not offer anything more than the toll free numbers of the vendors. Few offer a phone number of the RTA or a method to contact them.
3. When the money is shown to not be as expected, they are encouraged to solicit for a downline. Now, they are perpetuating the cycle by bringing in their "clients" and friends and family as more untrained people. Personally, I think it borders on abhorrent to use friends and family in that way--sell them travel and make a commission sure, but bringing them into a program like this is asking to be disowned. As this practice continues, it whittles away at your base for sellling travel, and it a decided shift (in the supplier eyes) to direct to consumer sales.
4. On the supplier end, the MLMs are selling credentials. True the supplier is at fault for accepting alternate creds, but the MLMs are taking advantage of that. It is a grey area. But most of the RTAs are traveling personally and NOT selling travel. So in essence they are getting a rebate, which is discouraged by all suppliers and banned by several. They are duping the suppliers into providing them advertising support, discounted travel, FAMS and training. If YTB trained 5000 agents in just one sitting for the CLIA card, why weren't more cruises sold on the one day sale? After all, the presentation has now made them card carrying trained cruise professionals. The answer is obvious--they are not in it to sell travel. They are in it for the perks and the discounts. Just as YTB is not in this business to sell travel. they are in it to sell websites. Look at the revenue of website revenue and commission revenue and you will see what I mean.
5. The RTAs are embarrassing. Their behavior is putting a black eye on the industry. Remember the old used car salesman stereotype? Traditional agents are not looking to go that route. We have worked hard to create a professional industry. Sure there are some bad eggs here and there, but overall it is a very professional serious group. We are not going to YouTube like Crazy Eddie, we are not walking into our competition and recruiting them to join our downline, we are not soliciting the competition's slients while on a cruise, we do not travel with t-shirts saying "I got here for free, ask me how", and we try to speak with a modicum of intelligence. Judging from the comments on this blog, and the emails I received after my column, I have to say, the MLM model fails on all fronts.
6. There is nothing black or white with the MLM model. They are all shades of grey. Some Indian chief used to say so and so "speak with forked tongue". It is rampant with the MLM model and their claims. One day cruise sale, I have heard numbers ranging from 8,000 to just under 100,000. 2006 sales, self reporting $226M when in actuality it was closer to $50M. Earn big money selling travel and the definition ends up being $60 a month.
7. And you also need to consider what has happened. In 45 days, YTB has lost the support of several vendors, had their IATAN endorsement revoked--and this is huge since it was one of the KEY selling points of joining the program. Your ID cards all say IATAN/CLIA number--you now need to take that off. That was a grey area anyhow...most likely a front line desk agent in the hotel would recognize the term IATAN but not necessarily know the look of the card and give you a perk--again unearned. By having those numbers on every ID card, you are alluding to each member being an IATAN or CLIA card holder. Illegal, nope, but definately grey.
8. Finally, you need to look at the financial end of this beast. While YTB did show a profit thi past quarter, there is a history there that should cause others to take notice. The former CEO was replaced (amicably) for allowing accounting irregularities. Yet his golden parachute is inflating now as he is selling all of his shares. The Chairman has divested almost all of his shares. So, what is happening there? Seems like the stock has had a nice run and quite possibly a lot of the 150,000 (now) RTAs may have bought a few shares. So, with the dilution so great, the principals can still control the company with fewer shares. And if it fails, they will have cashed out and earned a great amount in addition to the inflated salaries, and leave the majority of shareholders holding the bag. Just food for thought.
The issue, as I see it is multi faceted.
1. The vast majority of MLM agents (and this is not unique to YTB) are untrained (their personal fault), and have an unrealistic expectation of the money to be earned. They are going forth into the streets and professing to be travel agents. The public is believing this and getting a bum deal. The pricing is not any more attractive, and the risk of having a travel experience screwed up is great. Again, I am talking the majority--maybe not you.
1. Public getting a bum deal? Highly unlikely! They are getting the same exact vacation package they would get anywhere else!
2. An extension of that is that the consumer has very little places to go for help. The websites do not offer anything more than the toll free numbers of the vendors. Few offer a phone number of the RTA or a method to contact them.
2. My phone number is right on my website and I have direct lines to the vendors. I am ighly trained to assist any client with their travel needs!
There is also a 1-800 number that directs a client right to YTB if they have a change in itinerary or a cancellation.
3. When the money is shown to not be as expected, they are encouraged to solicit for a downline. Now, they are perpetuating the cycle by bringing in their "clients" and friends and family as more untrained people. Personally, I think it borders on abhorrent to use friends and family in that way--sell them travel and make a commission sure, but bringing them into a program like this is asking to be disowned. As this practice continues, it whittles away at your base for sellling travel, and it a decided shift (in the supplier eyes) to direct to consumer sales.
3. We are paid exactly what it states we are paid in commission! Building a downline is an option.
4. On the supplier end, the MLMs are selling credentials. True the supplier is at fault for accepting alternate creds, but the MLMs are taking advantage of that. It is a grey area. But most of the RTAs are traveling personally and NOT selling travel. So in essence they are getting a rebate, which is discouraged by all suppliers and banned by several. They are duping the suppliers into providing them advertising support, discounted travel, FAMS and training. If YTB trained 5000 agents in just one sitting for the CLIA card, why weren't more cruises sold on the one day sale? After all, the presentation has now made them card carrying trained cruise professionals. The answer is obvious--they are not in it to sell travel. They are in it for the perks and the discounts. Just as YTB is not in this business to sell travel. they are in it to sell websites. Look at the revenue of website revenue and commission revenue and you will see what I mean.
4. Where's the proof that RTAs are doing more personal travel than booking travel for others?
5. The RTAs are embarrassing. Their behavior is putting a black eye on the industry. Remember the old used car salesman stereotype? Traditional agents are not looking to go that route. We have worked hard to create a professional industry. Sure there are some bad eggs here and there, but overall it is a very professional serious group. We are not going to YouTube like Crazy Eddie, we are not walking into our competition and recruiting them to join our downline, we are not soliciting the competition's slients while on a cruise, we do not travel with t-shirts saying "I got here for free, ask me how", and we try to speak with a modicum of intelligence. Judging from the comments on this blog, and the emails I received after my column, I have to say, the MLM model fails on all fronts.
5. We are trained to act in a professional manner with out business.
6. There is nothing black or white with the MLM model. They are all shades of grey. Some Indian chief used to say so and so "speak with forked tongue". It is rampant with the MLM model and their claims. One day cruise sale, I have heard numbers ranging from 8,000 to just under 100,000. 2006 sales, self reporting $226M when in actuality it was closer to $50M. Earn big money selling travel and the definition ends up being $60 a month.
6. $60 a month? Surely you jest! I make a lot more han that a month from booking travel alone!
7. And you also need to consider what has happened. In 45 days, YTB has lost the support of several vendors, had their IATAN endorsement revoked--and this is huge since it was one of the KEY selling points of joining the program. Your ID cards all say IATAN/CLIA number--you now need to take that off. That was a grey area anyhow...most likely a front line desk agent in the hotel would recognize the term IATAN but not necessarily know the look of the card and give you a perk--again unearned. By having those numbers on every ID card, you are alluding to each member being an IATAN or CLIA card holder. Illegal, nope, but definately grey.
7. Just bumps in the road. Once a company gets big, they develope haters. YTB will get it's IATAN back.
8. Finally, you need to look at the financial end of this beast. While YTB did show a profit thi past quarter, there is a history there that should cause others to take notice. The former CEO was replaced (amicably) for allowing accounting irregularities. Yet his golden parachute is inflating now as he is selling all of his shares. The Chairman has divested almost all of his shares. So, what is happening there? Seems like the stock has had a nice run and quite possibly a lot of the 150,000 (now) RTAs may have bought a few shares. So, with the dilution so great, the principals can still control the company with fewer shares. And if it fails, they will have cashed out and earned a great amount in addition to the inflated salaries, and leave the majority of shareholders holding the bag. Just food for thought.
8. What former CEO was replaced?
Evidently you have absolutely no understanding of YTB - nor do you care to learn more about YTB! instead of going by what all the "haters" say, why don't you go take a trip to the YTB headquarters. I know why, You're ignorant, and ignorance is bliss.
Keep your linear income job. I'll work towards the residual, because we all know that residual income is better than the linear!
Excel failed because of deregulation of phone companies. Those phone cards became unnecessary! Excel wasn't shut down. Excel was sold.
1. Public getting a bum deal? Highly unlikely! They are getting the same exact vacation package they would get anywhere else!
False. Your pricing is often higher than other sources. The bum deal is that the public feels they are dealing with a legitimate agent working on their behalf. Most are not. The amount of client advocacy for the typical RTA is "go to my website". Did you see the story on the YTB agent that took 15K from a group? Sounds like a bum deal to me. YTB (I suspect) only paid to avoid more bad press.
2. My phone number is right on my website and I have direct lines to the vendors. I am ighly trained to assist any client with their travel needs!
There is also a 1-800 number that directs a client right to YTB if they have a change in itinerary or a cancellation.
Good for you. Now go look at the majority of the YTB sites--no number, no name, no email. You are the exception--kudos to you! The YTB toll free number--I have no faith. I called that number on the one day sale and they can only sell certificates. I asked which Carnival ship had the surfing thing and was told all of them. I was also told that they can sail from Pittsburgh, but on a limited schedule. When I went to book, I was told to call CCL to do that. Which I did and they said that the number I was given was an agent only line and offered to put me through to a PVP. The support you offer is not good!
3. We are paid exactly what it states we are paid in commission! Building a downline is an option.
Yes, but is the commission truly what you expected when you heard the pitch?
4. Where's the proof that RTAs are doing more personal travel than booking travel for others?
When Perrillo Tours says that 90% of the YTB bookings were found to be for the agents themselves, I can take that as proof. I am sure it is not as high on other suppliers, but come on..when the average commission is less than $70 a month---who do you really think is taking all these trips? Especially when the big pitch of the program is discounted travel and CLIA and IATAN cards.
5. We are trained to act in a professional manner with out business.
Most RTA need to take that class again. If tis is how you train your people to be professional, I shudder to think what is happening when you train them to sell travel.
6. $60 a month? Surely you jest! I make a lot more han that a month from booking travel alone!
I stand corrected. $57.05 a month. Check it out, it is on your site so it MUST be true.
http://www.ytb.com/downloads/RTA_Earnings.htm
7. Just bumps in the road. Once a company gets big, they develope haters. YTB will get it's IATAN back.
Just as YTB said the RCCL issue would be resolved--now they are saying they will never do business with them. IATAN is not going to relinquish this fight. They have you dead to rights. The next spin will be...we did not need IATAN anyhow.
8. What former CEO was replaced?
Evidently you have absolutely no understanding of YTB - nor do you care to learn more about YTB! instead of going by what all the "haters" say, why don't you go take a trip to the YTB headquarters. I know why, You're ignorant, and ignorance is bliss.
Michael Brent (a cronie of Tomer)was forced to resign when "accounting iregularities" were discovered--like not filing your reports for three years. It was an amicable departure with a great golden parachute. Check out the recent blog entry for information. But now the Founder has essentially sold his stake in the company as well. Hmmm makes one wonder.
"The amount of client advocacy for the typical RTA is "go to my website". Did you see the story on the YTB agent that took 15K from a group?"
Obviously, they didn't go to the website.
Yes, the commission is exactly what I expected. The pitch was "60% of the commission paid to YTB", and that's what I receive.
Now back to prices...
You say they are higher than other sites. In some cases, they may be, but I also do my own research and have found better deals on my website for my clients than on other sites. YTB can't be cheaper all the time! that would be obsurred!!! Keep in mind that we are NOT a DISCOUNT travel agency! What we are is a competitive agency! To put it into terms you can understand... if you go to the grocery stores, you will see a produck cheaper at one one week, but may find the same product cheaper in another store the following week. Comprende?
As a YTB RTA, I also have access to another agents only website where I can find even better deals for the exact same hotels and resort for my clients that wish to contact me personally. I could even find them better deals on airfare than what is listed on my website! We are a FULL SERVICE TRAVEL AGENCY!!!
About the 1-800 call center...
Did you book a trip from YTB?
NO!
Therefore you have no confirmation number and don't have access to any more information than what you got.
If you were in tune to the 1 day sale promo, you would have seen that there was a seperate 1-800 # set up for clients to ask questions about the sale and it was posted on the website! instead, you called the regular number and tied up the line asking questions that they weren't set to answer.
Meanwhile... somebody else... a client was probably trying to get through with a question concerning their confirmed booking.
All of this because you have to attack and attack with your one way views. You will NEVER truely know YTB, because you are not YTB.
Here's an idea!!! Why don't you go and attend one of the meetings so you can see for yourself. Maybe it will open our eyes.
As for some of the websites that don't have the info on them, we have business cards that do give our names, numbers, web address, and e-mail address. Remember, we use WORD of MOUTH ADVERTISING!!!
Now, getting to the agent who supposedly took money from a client...
We are taught right from the start that we are NOT to accept money from our clients personally! It is also written in black and white in out rules of conduct, so you cannot blame YTB for this in any way!
Now geting back to question #6
About the $57.05 a month. You took the lowest number an RTA has made at YTB. The reason for this number is because that RTA most likely hasn't done anything. if you don't do anything, you don't get paid! It doesn't take rocket science to figure that one out.
Hahaha... Got anything else???
I have gone through the booking process with YTB but not completed a transaction--you are correct.
I called the 800 number posted on every YTB site for the one day sale. They were clueless unless you were buying a certificate.
$57.04 is not the low--it is the average. And it is an average only of those that sold something. If we figure the ones that sold NOTHING (the majority) the AVERAGE drops to $9.43 a month. Quite a ROI.
And I do not like duck---too gamey and greasy, but might try the produck next time I shop.
That's right, you're used to eating crow... LOL!!!
Hey John, that number you see is based for only 1 month... JULY. It just shows that few people traveled during that month. Keep in mind that RTAs get paid when the trip is complete... not when it is booked. Now, look at the gross bookings for that month. All of those dollar signs you see have commissions pending. Research a few other months there John. Don't just speculate based on one month. Also, keep in mind that we have a lot more RTAs now than we did back in July.
Unless you truely see, you are going to keep speculating.
I don't even believe that you called the 1-800 number. Next time, try recording the phone call... LOL!
Sorry--recording phone calls in my state is illegal. Got Linda Tripp in trouble and I would prefer to do it legitimately, so you need to take my word for it. Sorry!
Well since YTB will only release current data dating to July, that is all I have to go on. And I realize that commissions do not reflect sales. So, let's do as you suggest Proud to be YTB...look at the bottom line on this sheet.
http://www.ytb.com/downloads/RTA_Earnings.htm
Pending commission. Can we agree that this is for travel booked yet not traveled? Here are some interesting calculations for you to spin for me...
The average commission on each of the 93K bookings is $21.20
The average commission earned for each RTA is $60.09. Mind you, you are only getting 60% of that so it is $36.05 per producing RTA. This does not seem like growth to me.
The estimated travel sold was about $25M. Now this is not for the month--this is total travel on the books and not paid. So, that represents an average sale of $764.06 per producing RTA. What are you guys selling? If we average it out among all RTAs the average is whopping $235.95 per RTA.
You have absolutely NO idea of what our commissions are. let me give you an example so you will understand a little better. For cruiselines, the vendors pay YTB 16% of the total sale. Of that 16%, the RTAs get 60% (I also get an extra 10% override, because I built my first team) Therefore YTB pays me 70% of the commission paid to YTB. Plus... since I am a team leader, I also get a 50% match for everything everyone in my 1st team earns. Like I said, you would have to attend a meeting in order to fully understand.
Also, look at the top of the sheet. It says RTA earnings... not YTB earnings!
Also, you have no idea what was booked in July, and neither do I. Some of the RTAs could have booked a lot of airfare which is a small commission. Others may have booked hotels and cruises (the big money maker). So, dividing one into the other... not knowing who booked what, of course it's going to become an average. I asure you that RTAs make more money from their bookings that what you can tell from this sheet. You can tell the total sales and total commissions from this sheet, but everything else is just useless information to your case.
The point is that we as RTAs are booking travel. If we weren't, then the total sales and total commissions would both be "$0".
Now, I am booking a cruise for 14 cabins. that's 28 people in a 25th weddding anniversary cruise. For 1 cabin on that cruise, without any excursions or other extras pre-paid for, my commission would be $350 and change (at 70%). Now multiply that by 14, add in the cost of excursions and other extras, and you will know that I do make some serious commissions!!!
Cruise lines do not pay commission on excursions.
If the report shows total commission (either earned by YTB or the RTA) it is the total commission earned. How can you say it does not apply.
So, let's say that someone on your downline sells some travel that generates $1000 in commission to YTB (for ease in the math. This person has built a team too.
$1000 cash into the system
The RTA get's 70% (60% and 10% because she built a team) of the commission $700
And because you are such a good agent and have brought her into the program, YTB gives you 50% of what she earns. $350
So now, YTB received $1000 and has paid out $1050. Well, how the hell does that work? The need to make up the $50 at least to break even. So where does this money come from--recruiting. Without recruiting you are nothing. THe model cannot sustain itself without recruiting
ANd eventually you are gonna piss off everyone within 3 feet of you and poof there goes any recruiting.....are you seeing the pyramid crumbling? I am sure the coach is from the mansion on the hill. BUt that is ok because he and Glagg and Cauthen and Brent and Coach Jr, and Kim are ok because they sold off their interest in the company while you all were too stupid and trying to figure it all out
You also have to figure out that not everyone has a team and earns the 10% override. Also, you are talking as if those cruises are being booked everyday. Get real!
$50 is absolutely nothing! it's 1 month's licensing fee for keeping your website up and running on the internet.
Crumbling??? Far from it!
If there are 200,000 RTAs and only 20% of them sell anything and each has a sale like that that is $40,000 X $50 or $2M and that seems like a loss to me
ANd as you say, you are selling a lot more than that, so on your 14 cabin deal YTB is earning $500. They are paying you $350 and then paying your upline person another $175. SO they have now lost $25 per cabin. $25 X 14=$350 they lost on ONE booking.
I try to MAKE money on bookings
I won't be losing money on bookings. I make money! Besides, you also have to think about ther fees vendors have to pay for companies to promote them. You see, Carnival doesn't promote YTB. YTB promotes Carnival who is advertising in YTB's website.
YTB has money coming in to support everything, so it's of no concern.
You have absolutely no understanding of how the business world works. Next time you want to post an ad in the Yellow Pages, ask them if you can do it for free? They will hang that phone up on you faster than you can even say the word "FREE".
You may want to take down the image on this post. IATA/IATAN's Terms of Use Sec 1 Para D states:
You may not copy, display, distribute, download, license, modify, publish, re-post, reproduce, reuse, sell, transmit, use to create a derivative work, or otherwise use the content of the Site for public or commercial purposes. Nothing on the Site shall be construed to confer any grant or license of any intellectual property rights, whether by estoppel, by implication, or otherwise.
I'm not sure of your use is considered "public or commercial purpose", but why take a chance?
How do you achieve credibility for your internet business?
So you have paid your money to whomever it is that has told you that you can get rich sleeping if you market and sell their product or services. You have gotten yourself a website and an URL with an interesting sounding name that differentiates you from the tens of thousands that are also selling the product and services, you were provided with, had someone make you an impressive website or built it yourself with all kinds of interesting information about the products you are selling and an e-commerce page that allows people to buy your products on line!
Now what.
Nobody is visiting your website let alone buying your products. So you start working on promoting your website in an effort to generate traffic. You start placing free classified ads or even paid ads in various internet publications such as Bacpage.com, Craig’s lists, Add-post, Lycos .com, Local.com, Domesticsales.com, Google base and so forth and so on.
You go to your website stats every day and still there is barely a noticeable trickle of visitors to your site.
You have already printed business cards, postcards and brochures at considerable cost courtesy of Vistaprint.com and have distributed them in the small town that you live in and have gone around your neighborhood, the golf club, the beauty parlors and put postcards promoting your internet business in every mailbox that you could find. You have spent a ton of money on print cartridges and glossy paper for your brochures.
You keep checking your visitors stats and be damned if you could find any increase in traffic of visitors to your website not to mention anyone buying anything from you.
What to do next?
You scour the internet for advice, watch hundreds of video’s that are all bait and switch schemes that promise the world and deliver very little, you try some of those get rich quick marketing schemes that do not work, throw more money away, send e-mails with promotional materials, including video’s, to whomever you can find in your outlook address book.
Make a ton of videos that you then upload to YouTube, Google, Yahoo, Mydeo, My Space, WAYN, Face Book, because the entire community of Guru’s tell you that it will increase your rankings on the search engines. This is only partially true with regard to your rankings in the video search pages but does not really help you with your rankings on the regular search pages.
And still barely anything happens to your daily visitors statistics.
So there must be something else that is required.
And of you go setting up your own blogs on subjects related to your business, commenting on other peoples blogs that are relevant to the business. Writing articles on EzineArticles.com and more commenting on other articles relevant to you business.
You join Adsense, put a Google search bar and Adsense ads on your website go to Commission Junction and get RSS feeds to earn commissions on their ads; all this in the hope that the cross polinization will drive traffic to your site. You get an XML site map for your sites, upload them to your site, register them with Google and Yahoo and get verified.
Surely you have done a fair amount with all of the above to get your sites noticed. I have had various refereed articles published in my name, that people are using to promote their websites such as Amazon.com, Strategic Finance, All Business and so on, I am not sure if they are successful, but these entries have been there for four years, so that must mean something. All you have to do is Google or Yahoo search “bou van kuyk” (my name) and at least Five to ten entries show up promoting the big name companies mentioned above, including my own three websites, but then who will ever look for a name like that unless they already know me?
Yet traffic to my websites remains anemic and I wonder what it is that I have to do next! Or what it is that prevents people from taking me serious.
I am good looking, have an honest face, am responsible, get my customers great value products, got a privacy statement on my website, have a published Toll free number, various IM buttons by which they can contact me thru Yahoo or MSN with a simple click, am approved/certified by Pay pal, have opened business accounts for each of my businesses so as to not commingle funds, so what is stopping people from making purchases on my website?
Although this sounds like an excuse, and I certainly have not thrown in the towel yet, but some of the reasons may be readily available.
First, I believe that the internet is riddled with no name scammers, MLM’ers and people that imitate big name companies to extract money from honest unsuspecting people, selling them stuff that does not really exist, who have been burned so many times that they have become gun-shy and are reluctant to part with their money to anyone that cannot positively verify that they are part of a well known chain.
The worst of these products and services are subscription based and typically start with a free trial period. The subscription kicks in automatically after the trail period and is invariably under $30 ($29.99) per month and non refundable. The trick here then is to make the cancellation method as cumbersome as possible, hoping that the customer forgets or gives up on trying to cancel it before the trial is over. At least one monthly subscription kicks in for an amount that is low enough for the customer not to sue to get it refunded and to let it go or write it off as a lesson learned.
Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me! This person will think twice before he or she enters into a transaction on the internet again and there are millions of them.
Secondly, the fact that any person who joins an MLM and is not one of the first to join, like number 98,996, will find it extremely difficult to make money without spending an inordinate a mount of time and money to get traction. So it is important to pick a business that does not depend on MLM to make money, unless you are one of the firsts to join.
Although I have been unsuccessful to date, I firmly believe that the YTB proposition of offering people and corporations their own website to book travel and receive commissions is a good one.
It is unfortunate that the MLM part is so widely publicized as the real money maker, which I believe it is not, except for the very few who came in at the top. It is merely a strategy to increase travel bookings under the YTB banner by the masses and so increase market share for YTB in sales of travel.
Most individuals that spend less than $6000 per year in travel should not own their own website, although of course any amount of travel that they book on their own website, no matter how small, counts toward sales of travel by YTB thus growing the company and increasing its market share.
The minimal amount of travel booked by these small owners, compared to the amount they spend for maintaining a YTB website has also skewed YTB’s earnings. YTB earns more from selling and hosting portals/websites than from selling Travel.
However the notion of taking out the middleman and offering the traveler the opportunity to be the travel agent instead is pure genius.
The traveler/corporation now has the opportunity to benefit from the commissions that the traditional middle man receives and lower their travel expenses with those commissions.
Additionally by becoming the middleman/travel agent, YTB offers its site owners the opportunity to be in charge of their travel arrangements. The site owner/traveler has full and direct access to the travel operators and as such has access to benefits that are not available to the ordinary traveler.
So I am convinced that I picked the right business model, but would like to only sell travel the “honorable way” by targeting people/corporations who can truly benefit/make a profit from having a turnkey secure hosted travel website and therefore by definition will buy at least $6000 per year in travel. I do this by openly publishing the one time set up costs of $450 and the monthly maintenance/hosting/ Liability insurance fee of $50 up front, which by the way may be the other reason why nobody comes to my site, perhaps I should hide the real costs just like everyone else!
That is the way to a win/win proposition, I make money from their travel, they save money on their travel and YTB increases market share in the travel business instead of the Website hosting business.
So I have not really been able to provide the answer to my original question. And I would be greatly appreciative for any helpful hints from fellow strugglers.
Having said all that, I invite anyone to comment on my observation of how to get noticed on the internet and to be taken seriously and my observations about YTB, MLM and Scammers.
A lot of numbers were being bounced around about the travel commisions and such previously. I think there is some confusion when it comes to YTB and travel and marketing. There really are 2 different companies. The 50% you upline gets is only for the marketing money, not the travel. With travel you receive 60% of the commision, your power team leader would recieve 10% and YTB receives the 30%. They keep the marketing money and the travel money completely seperated.
This information is all very interesting. It is clear that the anti-YTB crowd has no real understanding of how the YTB model works. I have been a CEO for major corporations for many years and studied the YTB numbers thoroughly before I joined. It is obvious that the anti-YTB'ers didn't do this. Since I joined many of my friends and family (including myself) have booked travel on my site and have often reported back that they got a much better deal with me than Expedia, Travelocity, Orbitz etc.
You guys are all missing something. Expedia, Travelocity and the rest of the online community put traditional travel agents out of business. Was that a good thing? No, but it happened. It is called progress or evolution. YTB's model is the next evolution. Nobody doubts that YTB will surpass Expedia as the largest online SELLER OF TRAVEL in the US in the foreseeable future. Is that going to upset a lot of people. Sure will. And those that sit there and moan and complain will look back at YTB 10 years from now and say the same things that traditional travel agents said about Expedia when they were forced to close their doors.
We have a large number of those traditional agents that were proactive and joined YTB and are now making ten times the income with little or no overhead. Are they to be regarded as traitors to the industry or as people that were intelligent enough to recognize the industry trends and adapt accordingly?
As a CEO of major corporations, I would think you might be a little more on the ball.
In case you have not noticed, travel agencies are still in business. They have shrunk in numbers and many have gone home based (overhead) and been acquired and merged, but they are still going strong. Recent studies also indicate the customer is becoming disenfranchised with the online model and are going BACK to traditional agencies.
Please tell us Mr or Ms. Anonymous...what major corporations did you head so successfully that you now need to participate in a MLM scheme?
Perhaps you can disclose how much you have made in YTB? Are you one of the lucky .003% that earned more than $20K last year? Or are you among the 99.997% that did not earn that much? Or perchance are you among the 80.9% that earned ZERO last year.
I counter that the YTB guys are missing something--the system is flawed and very few will make money. The numbers support that. Studies support that.
Look at the recent Founder's Tour---you put over $250K into the pockets of the Tomers in less than a month!
In July, there were 104K RTAs in the program that paid $5.2M to YTB to rent their website and YTB paid out a record $1M in commissions. So if YTB paid out $1M they earned $10M in commissions so for July, They received $15.2 million dollars and paid out $1 million in commission. Come on Mr or Ms. CEO--you have to see that!
As a matter of fact, it has NOT been an issue for anyone in YTB. The IATA is merely a membership organization and not an accrediting agency. It has nothing to do with preventing us from booking travel. Sorry to disappoint you!
denyse
Dense..what kind of name is that?
ATrueCTA, it's very interesting that people discuss information about which they know nothing!! We have access to every FAM you do!! I know because I take them.
denyse
MLM'S in TRAVEL...
a NO GO?
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